Nu am văzut asta venind (Boat Surveyor are știri FOARTE neașteptate)

36 thoughts on “Nu am văzut asta venind (Boat Surveyor are știri FOARTE neașteptate)”

1. Ive studied to be an art restorer (antiques). i left that field a couple of years after i finished my degree (no money in it). but i remember the difference between a copy and a replica. a replica would be a more accurate copy in as much one replicates all caracteristics, weight being also one of them.

   Now, the fruition of Art, and boats are Art as much as they are a product of Science (evolution thru millenia of observation) (look no further than a bristol/scillonian pilot cutter as one of the epitomes of naval design evolution) is different from the fruition of a sculpture, paint, or what have you.

   In the end we are preserving 2 zeitgeists: one about the "happening" of Dunkirk, the other about the physical object: the boat itself.
   Yes , there will be a time in the future when all the pieces on that specific boat will no longer be the ones present at Dunkirk, but their spirit remain.
   Im a fairly crazy person myself, thus i think objects talk to one another so do the pieces that make them, thats how the spirit of things gets thru Time.
   And when pieces cant talk to directly to one another directly they use us as messengers.

   This is why we restore and keep things Alive.

2. i think this question about how much of something can still be original before it becomes a replica of the original, is a question that appear quite often in other categories in the restoration field, especially in restoration projects of things like Steam locomotives, but i think the answers are the same. no matter how much of it you replace, doesn't mean that it's no longer what it was, it just means that it's continuing to go through it's natural life, eventually everything you restore given enough time is going to have nothing left of it's original self, that's an unavoidable fact.

   a good example of this is here across the pond in the U.S.A in my state one of the most famous Frigates from early American history, the U.S.S. Constitution affectionately know as "old Ironsides" calls the city of Boston, Ma it's home port. at 226 years old is is the oldest ship in the world still afloat, and furthermore still capable of sailing under her own sail, and still listed as Active on the U.S. Naval Fleet registry, crewed and served upon by naval officers and crews daily, and receives repairs from the same dry dock in which she was constructed in back in 1797. but today in 2023 only roughly 10-15% of the vessel is of original construction.

   despite this to the people of this great state and this great country, she remain a Symbol of freedom to the American people and a Stalwart defender of the country in it's infancy.

   i think the short way to sum up such a long statement would be best said as "just because nothing original remains doesn't mean it's not that thing anymore, it only stops being that thing when it means nothing to the people who see it, something only truly dies when it is forgotten by all."

3. Definitely restoration, imo. The bare structure of the boat is reasonably intact (70%) which is quite impressive for such an old boat that has worked hard most of her life. The skin is less important.
   Call me fussy, or a PitA, if you want but the 30% oak that you will need to source should ideally come from the UK or Ireland – perhaps Northern France, for strength and quality reasons. It is very much more expensive, though, than American oak or Spanish oak …
   Cadoha's issues sound concerning and serious, "months of work" I think you said or hinted at: I hope it can be resolved at reasonable cost to you …

4. I'm not sure on the percentage, but in restoring old/vintage/collectable cars, as long as the chassis and engine are matching numbers from factory, most everything else can be replaced and it would still be classed as Original.
   70% of the skeleton/chassis original and most else being replaced 'like-for-like' would stay well in the "Restoration" zone.
   "Float-on Little boat, float on with pride."

5. Ah now we’re talking Ship of Theseus! Every former philosophy student reaches for their notes…

6. Rebuild is the term I use. That means replace what needs to be replaced, keep and preserve what is still usable. It is part of the life of a wooden boat to have parts replaced over time. But, what is important is that the spirit of the original boat is retained.

7. To my mind it’s a restoration but either way it’s keeping the memories alive and respecting our nations great history.

8. Is this something that I could get involved with from time to time as a volunteer? I'm an engineer with alot of boat experience and based in Portsmouth, would love to get involved.

9. Its a bit like Triggers Broom… (UK reference). Definately a restoration, over its history I am sure lots of bits got replaced. I am a great believer in things evolving through time, just becuase you have updated bits of it doesn't take away from its story. over time if bit by bit it is totally replaced the thing is still the thing.

10. SAMPSON Boat is the better place to answer your questions

11. For me I think that's definitely a restoration Dom. 👍😊

12. Keep all those crusty bits, mount them and frame em up official number on them and flog em off to fund the restoration. Just a thought.😊

13. Even if it's a "replistoration", some boats are worth the effort.

14. Consider Michael Frosts Boadicea CK 213. When Michael took her on she had already been rebuilt a couple of times, She started clinker. then was doubled carvel, then totally replanted with many new frames. When Michael Fros finished, there was only one single piece of deadwood left from the original. She is still the same boat.
    Also consider the Pioneer CK 18.

15. First, it is absolutely a restoration, the boat is substantially intact and you’re replacing the bits that are missing or in poor shape.
    Second re the ongoing project, nothing is ever much valued unless it has a contemporary commercial value. So the great trick with old things from the past that we want to preserve is to make sure they have a commercial value in this day and age so they continue to be valued without the constant drain of applying for government funding, which always ends. By putting her to work, you provide the commercial value, which will allow her ongoing preservation. And of course, nothing falls to bits quicker than an unused boat!

16. I think restoration as long as the Bones are kept we all shed skin and might have i few bits replaced we are stii us 😊

17. A soft fading cry from Southern Queen was heard. The heart and soul of all those that were touched by her and were are a part of her thru her service were asking for assistance. So 30% stints and bone grafting , 80% artificial limbs, many a veteran live such lives now. No one wonders if they are a replica.

18. IMHO if a boat is rebuilt from existing and remaining timbers it is a restoration, to be a replica it would be made from scratch from blueprints (such as the Cutty Sark or The Matthew)

19. How about calling it a 'renovation' and steer away from restoration and replica. Simples

20. I would definably call it a restoration as you are restoring the ship. A replica is a copy or imitation of the ship. I personally love old wooden boats and would own one if I had the money to maintain it.

21. I call it restoration even if only 10% of her was useable

22. As long as it has one original plank in it it is the original boat. This boat will always be the original no matter how many refits. It has too much of a spot in British history for it to loose its soul.

23. Even, say 30% of the frame would be restoration, enough to replace timbers with similar ones and the detail too.

24. Now that Matt and Amy of sailing Florence are finishing their Carribean adventure. I think it is time that the Cadoha crew set sail for the West Indies and apply your dulcet David Attenborough tones to the channel. No 1 new adventure. No 2 it is perfect for you both and the Hank lad. Have a think about it.

25. The famous question of the Ship of Theseus. One which also enters into personal identity – if most of your cells are replaced every 7 years… so do you think you are really you? 🙂 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus

26. bla-bla-bla……..

27. With any boat you would have been replacing boards and stuff over time if it had been kept up with. It is just being done all at one time rather than over a span of years. I'm leaning toward it's the same boat, original, but with upgrades and refurbishing just like Cadoha.

28. Triggers broom? I'd argue a replica is 90%+ items not in the original. A bit like a kit car. You are restoring. 🙂

29. Ah yes. Restoration or replication. I reckon that if she can retain the percentage of her original timbers that you assert, then no question. It's a restoration. She's the same boat with substantially new planking. Consider. Old Mcdonald. He's been in the wars, has a glass eye, a prosthetic leg, has had a heart transplant, a new kidney, two new hips. He also sports a pathetic and immediately apparent, somewhat tatty old rug. But! He's still old Macdonald isn't he? I rest my case. and furthermore I don't actually care! save the old girl. She has a priceless history.

30. On the question of restoration of Southern Queen, I can not see the issue regarding this being a problem. If a peace meal patch up is attempted, then there will be no end of problems resulting in an eventual pile of firewood. Restoration to bring back the boat to it's ORIGINAL state must be worth the time and effort. In other words, do it properly or don't do it at all. Do we really want to lose another piece of our maritime history because of squabbles about degrees of restoration?

31. there is a large percentage of the original vessel still remaining and will still be there when completed YES it is a restoration as is happening with 'shipshappens'' another old vessel being done by a couple in England ,and myself i come from the land down under. good luck and fair winds

32. So yes it is the same boat – this has actually already been to court on several ocasions – it's absolutely a restoration, there's more to a boat than its planking or its structure – it's an entitiy in itself. If you think about the amount of yachts sailing around the world with pretty much everything replaced on them it's not really that different. To to mention the famous long lasting hammer that had had several new heads and handles over the years :-)!

33. It’s the heart and spirit of a boat that really matters.

34. Here's my idea:

    1. build a second frame which is a perfect replica of that of the original boat
    2. remove whatever softwood that needs to be replaced, and replace it with fresh wood
    3. take the old softwood, and attach it to the replica frame

    in the end, you will have two vessels that are half-original, although only the restored original will be more seaworthy

35. In my family we have a number of tools that have been around seemingly forever. One in particular is an axe. It’s as old as dirt. Its actual history is lost to the mists of time. We think that over the years it has been repaired and rebuilt many times. In living memory there have been a couple of new handles and at least one new head. But it’s the same old axe.

36. At 70% of the core structure it is definitely a restoration with so much of the historic boat still there. Even 50% counts as restoration in my book.

    It would be nice to see it doing some crossings to Dunkirk every May and June.

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