Placi de lant din fibra de carbon??? | Înțelepciunea navigată [S6 Ep1]

37 thoughts on “Placi de lant din fibra de carbon??? | Înțelepciunea navigată [S6 Ep1]”

1. I didn't know carbon fibre chain plates were a thing, however I do know from my experiences racing bikes that there are 2 types of carbon fibre, the cheap stuff that is basically carbon fibre weave in resin that is made the same as fibre glass, and the 'proper' carbon fibre which is the same thing but is baked when it is laid up and is far stronger. The cheap stuff is rubbish by comparison and will explode into dust and fibre if it experiences a lateral impact whereas the good stuff is more resiliant and better made. Honestly don't skimp on the costs. Secondly why are the bolts and chain plates so expensive??? you could get titanium for that price lol

2. The Duracel Project on Youtube built multiple carbon chainplates for his boat. Doesn't look too complicated.. https://www.youtube.com/@TheDuracellProject

3. Yeah, well instead of having bolts transfer the forces to the hull, the fiber bond – a mechanical bond – will transfer those forces. Just gluing something in doesn't make it part of the whole. I hope you study it well.

4. Not sure that you need carbon. Weight doesnt seem a critical factor for this project. Why not use unidirectional glass instead. The finished product will be bulkier and heavier, but this shouldn't be a problem.

5. Why did the original builder of the boat add a strip of “iron” that went all the way to the keel. That seems so unnecessary. There must have been a purpose. Was it part of a grounding system intended to deal with lightning strikes to the rig?

6. the boat im buiding right now will have composite chain plates,it will be E-glass and it designed by a naval architech

7. Young Barnacles is another channel that has a series on a carbon chain plate build. Living On The Ocean is also a channel with a lot uni carbon layups, although I don't think he ever builds a chain plate. But the concepts transfer.

   I would not attempt it with E-glass, as some suggest. You have to have at least double the thickness (probably more) to match the strength of carbon.

   And if I were doing this, I would want to ensure that the strength of the chain plate at least matches the breaking strength of the weakest link in the shroud. Probably better if it exceeds by a 50% margin, or so. You want your shroud to break long before the chain plate rips out of the boat.

   VectorPly is a company that manufactures and distributes composite materials and they have an online program called VectorLam where you can make up a laminate and it'll give you the mechanical properties. It is, of course, an estimate, as much of engineering is. But it's a starting point.

8. While Kevlar is difficult to bond with epoxy the tensile strength is also suitable for tensile applications.

9. i guess be glad it was so corroded!

10. From what i have seen of carbon fiber i would not use it. Any flex breaks .

11. Hey rigging doctor. A few years ago I spoke with a engineer who specializes in carbon hulls. He worked on a few Volvo race designs. All their boats have carbon fiber chain plates and he told me that the standard design is to build the chain plate 5X the breakage of the shroud. If there are 2 shrouds on the same chain plate then you add them up. He would not tell me the formula he used to calculate how thick or how many layers of carbon fiber is required. On the Duracell project I believe he used 36 layers again that was specific to his build but 5 X the breakage of the shroud is the standard and you must use uni directional carbon fiber.

12. Wow ! I seen the making and installing of the carbon and fiberglass chain plates on Duracell Project, I think it would cost 1/4 of those silicone bronze parts and you never have to do anything or worry about them again!

13. Mixing composites, eg grp and carbon, is a bad idea – unless you are an Open 60 team with the world’s best design engineers, and the relative budget.

14. Duracell project did carbon chain in refit

15. In "THE DURACEL PROJECT" YouTube Channel you can learn how do it!!!!
    He made a incredible job with the fiberglass and the carbon fiber!!!!
    There you have all solutions for your problems!!!
    He's the best!
    This channel is incredible!
    Good luck!

16. Anyone who's caught the "carbon fiber fever" needs to watch and understand the concepts of this excellent short video on the relative characteristics of e-glass, s-glass, kevlar and carbon fiber: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHXVf0SaJpA They may not behave the way you think they do, especially in combination as discussed here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7bQYEt_qtU.

17. Check out Alex Thomson's race boat structural failure in the bow of his boat as well as gunrunners carbon fiber mast failure. I respect your desire for the cool factor but your families safety does not need to be cool.

18. To be honest I'd be terrified to have carbon fiber chain plates…I've watched CF fail on those huge racing boats and its scary. I've watched an entire boat snap in two. Maybe its better, IDK but i hope it works out for you.

19. You and your projects are definitely interesting and adventurous. I would like to see how this works. Retro fitting new technology in an old hull.

20. Just remember those dudes went down to see Titanic in a carbon fiber submersible….😝

21. dont forget you can combine composites . kevlar is really for impact resistance, but you might consider a carbon reinforced composite structure, as carbon fiber tends to be brittle by itself. you can vacumn bag and cook in a homemade oven if you want. am so excited in anticipation of future videos

22. How are chain plates not made out of carbon fiber forevermore?

23. Expedition Evans is doing carbon fiber and a special ty[e of fiber glass over special foam board now. They are vacuum bagging the parts as well.

24. 👍👍👍

25. I do know that carbon fiber layups and the tremendous current and voltage surge of a solid lightning strike do not play well together. This was a significant roadblock to the technologies use in aircraft. Though in common use today, it was a steep learning curve getting to this stage.

    Beechcraft built and sold a number of corporate aircraft ( the Beech Star ship) using a carbon fiber composite structure. Only after being in service was it discovered the vulnerability to electrically caused structural damage, be it from static discharge or lightning strikes. Beechcraft eventually bought these aircraft back seeing the potential for a catastrophic structural failure, and destroyed them.

    I’ve repaired a number of sail boats having had hard solid lighting strikes. The damage suffered is completely unpredictable even on boats having quality electrical bonding. I’ve seen heavy bonding cables with insulation covering melted from the fraction of a second lightning strike.

    I would do a deep dive into the subject before adding a direct load bearing component to the standing rigging which could be asked to be a current path in the event of a lightning strike. Particularly so on a boat intended for long distance cruising.

26. Buy silicon bronze bar stock, and the thread each end. I have to believe one if your patrons has a bridgeport and would make you some nuts. I did, but unfortunately just sold everything I own to go sailing. Inspired in part by you, however ironic that may be…

27. This may be a moot point if you do end up going with some sort of composite chainplate, but it appears on the video that the bolts you currently have in your chainplates are actually 1/2” bolts with 3/4” inch nuts. If you do end up going back with bronze, you may be able to reduce the bolt size which would have potentially a significant cost reduction

28. Sorry I missed your zoom chat. I have worked with carbon fiber for 34 years in the aircraft industry.

29. Something to think about is the stress strain curve for CF. Steel has a yeild plateau where you can continue stretching it after it riches its yield stress (by about 250%) – hence a ductile material. CF will tend to have a linear curve to failure ie. When yield is reached it fails. From this perspective I think CF chain plate needs to be designed for higher force (1.5 or 2x the yield capacity of your stay?). The chain plate cannot be the weak link in the system and it's lack of a yield plateau has to be considered in the design of the rigging system (you always want the failure point to be in the ductile component of the system ie. the stay).

30. Carbon fiber is very good at some things not so good at others , it's no good at all for being shocked as in what happens when you loose a stay an the mast is whipping around , also you have an old boat the glass on it has water in it will be very hard to get a good bond in the first place and would take an engineer to design the fix if it is going to have any chance of being reliable , you may think your boat is overbuilt but there was a reason the designer brought the chain plates down to the floors and keel , I wouldn't try to out think him , just use stainless steel run them down where they belong , won't cost much but will be some work and call it a job well done , stainless is cheap and strong and you can make your own from flat stock , will probably last until your an old man , IMHO

31. Yes

32. Bronze to the topside? Did I hear that right? What's with the copper bonding lug? Lightning protection or just a common earth bond? Will the bronze be up to the cyclic loading? If that's the overall intention…?

33. We just redid ours in 316, but I think our next set will be titanium. The raw flat patterns for grade 5 titanium were about double the cost of steel but that's going from about $40 each to $80 each, and then the added cost of heat treatment after forming only adds a marginal amount to the final total. Carbon fiber will be cool to see though!

34. It's super strong, just don't make a submarine out of it.

35. That’s a hard no from me. Carbon fiber is impact sensitive. Whack the top of one of those chain plates on a dock, it’s compromised. Plus you are relying on the interlaminant bond of 40 year old fiberglass. To hold a pretty big spar in place in a hurricane. Others have mentioned lightning so I won’t bother. Bronze is incredibly durable. It tolerates moderate deformation. It’s slightly malleable. Some jerk with a cruddy anchor winds up along side you in a blow, while bronze might bend a little and you’re like, might be able to bend it back with a mallet instead of oh. Now we got to tear all that glasswork out to replace a Chainplate.
    Lastly you can bolt those on with stainless. Check one every five years.
    Regarding the bottom bolt in a chainplate. You said you are supposed to leave 20 times the diameter of the fastening below the last bolt?

36. Carbon fibre would certainly take care of the corrosion issues. Why not run the carbon fibre component all the way up through the deck and to the rigging.

37. Hot dip galvanize perhaps…

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